Brenda 00:00:01 Welcome to your yes, build life. I'm your host, Brenda Winkle, educator, healer, speaker, guide and fierce advocate for your. Yes, I help sensitive and successful men and women find, reclaim and live from their full embodied. Yes, through empowering you to understand your energetic hygiene, establish healthy boundaries, and heal your nervous system, you'll be able to create your yes filled life and move through your days with more freedom, more ease, and more joy. You'll hear inspiring stories of people who found their full bodied, yes thought leaders who pursued their own dreams and are living life on their terms, and learn new ways to find the courage, joy, ease and freedom to more fully step into your yes filled life. Saying no to the good so you can say yes to the great. Join me on this journey to discover your yes filled life. Whether you're looking to break free from the golden handcuffs, start a new business, find your dream job, or simply live with more intention and mindfulness, I've got you covered.
Brenda 00:01:15 Let's explore the possibilities together and make your dreams a reality. Ready? Let's do this. Let's get you to your yes filled life. Hello and welcome to your yes filled life. Today you are in for such a treat. We have Ellen Long on the podcast and you are going to absolutely love this conversation. I felt like the conversation that Ellen and I had was medicine for me, and really gave me a permission slip to create not only a business that I love, but a life that I love. And I think that you're going to love it too. Before I tell you about Ellen, I want to give you a quick life update. I started full time travel in June of 2024, and I visited quite a large number of states in the US, and I am currently recording this from Portland, Oregon, which is where I started. Well, specifically, I started in Lake Oswego, but I'm actually in Portland and I'm feeling the end of my full time travel journey approaching, and I have narrowed down two big places that I want to target as possible places to land.
Brenda 00:02:32 And I'll tell you more about that as it evolves. One of the things I've been personally navigating is the grief around my dad's death. And also, when combined with the full time travel, all of the decisions that need to be made, all of the constant changes that are happening in my location and my living arrangements and it's really caused me to need to lean on some ways to make sure that my energy, my emotions, are optimized in order to show up the way I want to show up for my friends, my family, my clients, and for you. And so I have been very much relying on one of the PDFs I created for you. It's called the Feel Better Fast Guide, and the reason that it works so well is that it gives broad categories of ways that you might feel better, ranging from fragrances that are meaningful to you, to songs to fabrics or textures to activities that you could do, even colors that you like or flavor profiles. And so I've been relying on this feel better fast guide just to allow myself a little boost, a little shot in the arm, so to speak.
Brenda 00:03:45 And so I wanted to mention it today. If you are noticing as the seasons change or as you're navigating a life circumstance, that That feeling good feels a little bit more challenging sometimes. I'm going to invite you to download this free guide. You can grab it at Brenda winkel.com forward slash. Feel better fast. That's all. One word, all lowercase. And I promise you it really works. I say that, because I promise you this guide works. I've used this technique for probably 12 or 15 years at this point, and I promise you it works. And here's why. When you're really in it, you're having an emotional moment. You're feeling crunchy or stressed or anxious or even sad. Sometimes it's very difficult to remember the things that you like because you get so in it. Right. So this guide is something that you can take five or maybe ten minutes to do on your own. And I've got it all scaffolded for you. So it'll just take you a few minutes and you're going to remember all the things you like when you're in a non activated state, sometime when you're calm and then when you're having those crunchy moments or contractions, as I call them, you can go access this guide and it's listed for you.
Brenda 00:05:09 And then you can select one of the activities or one of the other things on the guide to help yourself feel better, to get out of whatever funk you're in very, very quickly. So go grab this free guide. It's literally gold right now. I'm using it myself. Brendan winkle.com forward slash. Feel better fast. Now this conversation you're about to hear with Ellen Lang. I absolutely adored the day that we had it. And I met Ellen in a speaking course that was taught by Patrick Combs and Samantha Skelly, and there was something that she said in the course that made me say to her, please, please come on the podcast and you're going to get to meet her and hear exactly what that was, And I promise you, you're going to love this episode. When I went back in to edit our conversation for the episode, first of all, I didn't do any edits. I just listened again. It felt like medicine, and it feels like medicine because Ellen has such a holistic approach to how she looks at life.
Brenda 00:06:11 And I think that you're going to love this conversation. You're going to leave feeling inspired and empowered to create a life that you really love. And not only are you going to feel inspired, but you're going to have some tools that you can use along the way. So about Ellen, behind every successful business is a captivating story. Ellen Long's mission is to help business owners build and sell the best business story for the most profitable exit. She is a Woman to Watch Award winner. A graduate of the Leadership Wilmington Class of 2013, course creator for Wealth Fit Inc and a TEDx speaker. The journey to enough finding your minimum viable happiness. Ellen's consulting experience and passion for educating enables her to help clients find solutions and new ways of thinking that not only spur a greater profitability, but better relationships. Without further ado, here is Ellen Long. Hi, Ellen. Thank you for being here.
Ellen 00:07:12 Thank you so much for having me. I'm excited about today.
Brenda 00:07:14 Oh my gosh, I'm excited to. This is going to be an amazing conversation.
Brenda 00:07:19 So if we just dive right in I'd love to ask what is one thing you either did or didn't do that's brought you to your yes filled life?
Ellen 00:07:28 Oh, I love this. So I was thinking about this actually this morning, and honestly, I think it has to do more with character traits than what I did or didn't do. And so I've really been thinking about this concept of in order to have a yes filled life, you really have to be three things. You have to be open, you have to be curious, and you really have to be brave. I, I think the theme of my life is Robert Frost. You know, I've taken the road less traveled by and it's made all the difference. But when you take the road less traveled by, there isn't like a, you know, road map of here's the path of your life, and you just do every single thing on it. It's open, it's curious, and it's full of possibilities, but it's also full of risk too.
Ellen 00:08:08 And so I think acknowledging that and accepting that and being in that place has been incredible and made all the difference.
Brenda 00:08:15 I love this for so many reasons, including a little wink that you would have no way of knowing about. that poem was my dad's favorite poem. Oh my gosh, that was a poem that we read at his memorial service. And so for you to pop in and just say those things, I'm like, okay, there's a little wink. So we're off to a great start.
Ellen 00:08:36 I love it, let's go. Let's do it.
Brenda 00:08:38 Oh my gosh, it's so good. So when you think about the road less traveled by or when I think about it, I'm thinking there's not often a map. There's often not very many footprints, if any, to follow. How do you find the bravery that you talked about to take the steps that you know in your heart are right for you?
Ellen 00:09:02 Yeah. I think, understanding when I understood that I am really like creating an architecting my own life and accepting that as wow, like, I have this amazing opportunity to create and be a kind of like a master of my own fate, if that makes sense.
Ellen 00:09:18 And so I think when you start with that of, hey, whoa, if I step back instead of just doing the next thing and kind of having blinders on and following this life, I can step outside of it and say, I could plan my own life, I can architect my own life like I have the freedom and the opportunity to do that. And if I would step into that and really take time and the energy and the effort to do that, it completely changed my life. So I think even from a young age, I had this concept of I don't want to, you know, follow the road that most people are traveling. I want a different one. But then the question is, okay, what does that road look like? And what do I want that road to look like? And how do I step into that? And I think, honestly, I'm learning more and more that it's really taking the time to sit down and ask yourself, what do I love? What do I not like to do? What do I want my life to look like? And really just taking the time to sit down and plan it?
Brenda 00:10:12 Oh, that's like a mic drop moment I love that.
Brenda 00:10:15 You know I was journaling this morning and I was journaling about the concept of familiarity and how we can mistake or I can mistake familiarity for peace for contentment when maybe it's not peace or contentment. Maybe it's just familiar.
Ellen 00:10:35 That's so interesting. Yeah I love that.
Brenda 00:10:37 And so you know when I was thinking about what you were saying about just being willing to sit down and create something that really works for you. How do you differentiate between your need for familiar which maybe you have one, maybe you don't, and the newness that you want to bring in.
Ellen 00:10:57 Oh, so I think you should always have both. I think we can be new. As better new. As you know, new is fun. New is free, new is better. I work with a lot of entrepreneurs. So just for people to know sort of my background, we help entrepreneurs build a business. And then if they want to sell it. So they're in this mode of, I'm going to build a business to sell it. Right.
Ellen 00:11:17 And so I live in entrepreneur life and in entrepreneurial life. We are A.D.D. we're distracted, we love new, we love possibilities. We love all these things. And so I think, my coach, actually, Doctor Jeff Spencer, he likes he likes to call this concept the stable planet. So it's like, what in my life is a stable planet that I can count on that is familiar and beautiful and true, and I love. And it gives me the stability to then go out and risk and have possibility. So I'm not just like walking on a tightrope without a harness, right? It's like, no, I have a net below me that I know will catch me. People that love me, you know, a maybe a stable income that I can count on. And then once I have that, then I can go risk and have possibility and do all these things. So I know there's this concept of like, you just have to jump off the cliff. And I'm very much in the, in the camp of, yeah, jump off the cliff, but maybe tie a bungee rope, you know, like maybe have something to do.
Ellen 00:12:11 So you're not just like, you know, throwing all, all, you know, safety to the wind and you're just going to dive off and jump. And sometimes life does ask us to do those things and we don't get the option. But to me, if you can build it. So it's like, wow, I'm building this stable foundation and on this stable foundation I can build a beautiful life. So I really encourage people to think about, like, what are those stable things in my life? What are the friends like? I have amazing, stable friends, right? So when I go into these risks and possibilities, I know I have this net of people, this crew, I think all entrepreneurs, all people should have a crew, like build a crew of people that support you, that love you, that challenge you, that right. And they kind of anchor you to the ground while at the same time letting you fly. And I think that's so important in this journey.
Brenda 00:12:54 I couldn't agree more.
Brenda 00:12:55 I absolutely couldn't agree more with everything that you said. I think that there is a lot of talk right now about just getting your energy right. And I, I mean, as an energy healer. Yes. Let's get our energy right. I completely believe that. And also there has to be inspired action behind it. And if we are in a nervous system, freeze because we're so scared about the risks that we're going to take because we have no safety. A lot of times we can't do the big, bold, audacious thing.
Ellen 00:13:27 Yep. Exactly. So, you know, and I, I know a lot of your audience is kind of in our age group. And, you know, in my 20s, how I live my whole life was I just said yes to everything. And I think, you know, in your 20s, that's a beautiful place to be. Like Knowing the stage that you're in is also super important. So in my 20s, I had time and I had energy. And so you know what I said? Yes.
Ellen 00:13:48 And I traveled the world. People would be like, hey, do you want to go to Fiji in two weeks? Yes. Let's go, you know, do you want to go to South Africa? Absolutely. Let's take a helicopter ride around Table Mountain. Like I just said yes to everything. But then you know what happens in your 30s. And part of my journey was I said yes to everything. And I ended up with Hashimoto's because I absolutely burn myself out. And I think in your 30s and in your 40s, you transition into this period of, hey, you know what? I have less energy and I have less time, but I'm also wiser and I make better decisions. And my my gut intuition is better. So you're learning to trust that intuition that you've built up over years? Hopefully. Right. And so in your 30s and your 40s, the question now is, okay, how do I think about this in I love being practical. So I even have this Excel spreadsheet where it says, like, here's the opportunities that I have.
Ellen 00:14:38 Here's the things that are really important to me. Does this opportunity meet all of these? Is it the people that I want to spend time with and build something with? Is it is it using my unique abilities, like creating your own criteria for these things and then saying, okay, how much time and energy will this thing take? How much extra time and energy do I have? And then being so honest with ourselves and I think this is part of it, you have to be so honest with yourself. How much time and energy do I have? And if that thing is so important to me, what am I willing to cut out to make it work?
00:15:08 I love that.
Brenda 00:15:09 And what you're speaking to is discernment. Yeah, so I was I got divorced when I was 35, and I went on this journey of like, I'm going to try and find myself. And at one point I was probably 38, 39, and I decided I was going to have the year of yes. And I was going to accept every invitation, every date, every social opportunity, every career opportunity.
Brenda 00:15:35 And oh my gosh, I had some crazy experiences and then I realized, okay, so yes, I it's important to say yes. And a little discernment goes a long way.
Ellen 00:15:45 Exactly. But you know what? I think everyone should do that. I actually I was sitting at this dinner, I'm in Genius Network, and we had this women's dinner and I was telling my story of my year of. Yes, I did the same thing. I said yes to every conference, every speaking engagement, like everything. And it was incredible. The journey I went on was insane. And I was telling this woman this and she's like, oh my gosh, I'm going to do that. And about three months later she texted me and she's like, you won't believe what happened. And I think this is where it's like being open to possibilities and saying yes. And she's like, I've been on TV. I've got a I've got all these deals coming at me. Like my life has completely changed. The trajectory of my life is totally different.
Ellen 00:16:23 But I love the discernment there of of okay, now I have all these opportunities. Now I've done yes, for so many months. How do I not get burned out by all of this? Now it's time for discernment. So I think there's those stages of creating opportunity. And you have to get out there and you have to do things. And then as the opportunities come in, more and more and more, that's where the discernment comes and you're like, okay, I've created all these opportunities. Which ones do I really want to go after? Because I want to go after it with my heart and my soul and my, you know, and I'm good friends with Nick Peterson. And he has this one phrase, you never you you'll never win a game you don't want to play.
00:17:00 Oh that's.
Brenda 00:17:01 Good. Yeah. And I think.
Ellen 00:17:02 So often we, we get into these games that we don't really want to play and then we don't win and we beat ourselves up. We're like why am I, why do I, I can't get my heart into this.
Ellen 00:17:11 I can't give it my all. Like this isn't who I am. What's happening? And I think sometimes it's just taking a step back and being like, wait, do I even want to be in this game? Do I even want to win this? And finding those areas where you're like, no, no, no, I want to put my all into this and I want to, I want to do the best that I possibly can. This is a game I want to win at.
Brenda 00:17:28 Oh my gosh, that's so good. And when you mentioned burnout again, I'd love to circle back and hear more about your story. Can you just share kind of what the work is that you do in the world? You mentioned it briefly, but go ahead and just dive in. Take us on the journey.
Ellen 00:17:43 Yeah, yeah. So I was a straight-A student all the way through my masters. So from high school to masters, so total achiever crazy. I was captain of three teams in high school, you know, MVP of all of them just, you know, achieve achieve achieve achieve.
Ellen 00:17:59 And so in my 20s, it was I was never enough. I always felt like I should do more, be more, see more, all of those things. And so I lived this amazing, yes filled life, but it was always with this sense of, gosh, I'm just not doing enough. Right? And so in my 30s, then I go on this year filled year and I just completely burnt out because I don't have the energy anymore. And I didn't have the discernment. I just said yes to everything. And so I actually read this thing this morning. It was really interesting, actually. Patrick, our speech coach, that we were in the program, he sent me this thing and it was like, you know, we're now in a time in the world that we've never had before, which is we truly are really. We can take mastery over our life. And what I've realized is, while we were really bad masters of our own life. Right. Like we have self autonomy in a way that we've never had in the world before.
Ellen 00:18:49 And what have we done with it. We're horrible masters. We you know, beat ourselves up. We tell ourselves we're not enough. We force ourselves to be productive all the time. And one thing that we do that I love is, you know, entrepreneurs come to us and they say, hey, I want to build my company to 30 million or 50 million or 100 million, and then I want to sell it. They come to us to build a beautiful business. And what I love, what we do is we also help them build a beautiful life. So I actually had an entrepreneur today send me an email and say, wow, like I cried when I read what you said sent. And this is the guy who's running this really successful business. And it was because I said, hey, you don't have to build a business. We have this idea that you have to build a business. It should be built this way.
00:19:30 And I told him, I'm like.
Ellen 00:19:31 Why don't we build a business that you love, that you.
00:19:36 Want.
Ellen 00:19:37 And we can build that around your unique ability? I want you to have a business that you love to run, because you get to work in your unique ability. You get to do what you want, and you get to build it however big you want. There's no shoulds in this entrepreneur world. What I love about entrepreneurship is we can build whatever we want to build. And so for him, it was this understanding of like, oh my gosh, here I was in this role that I thought I should play, right, as CEO of this company. But here's the thing that I really want to do. And instead being able to do that and also build a really beautiful, fabulous business. So the intersection of those two things is my favorite thing to do, which is how do we build a business and a model and a structure that supports your life so that you can also have a beautiful life? Let's do both.
Brenda 00:20:24 Oh my gosh. I'm just letting that sink in for a minute because it's so powerful.
Brenda 00:20:28 And it goes back to what you were saying your quote from your friend Nick, who said, you can't win a game that you don't want to play. And it's the same thing in our businesses. But oftentimes we forget that if we don't want to do the thing that we're doing in our business, it isn't going to be successful no matter how good we are at it.
Ellen 00:20:48 Absolutely. Yeah. We have this concept in entrepreneurship of this hustle and grind of if there's a roadblock, you just, you know, you just get yourself up to it and you and, and I like to say, hey, why don't we pause? Why is this roadblock so massive? Right. Like maybe it's because we're not supposed to go that direction. Maybe the roadblock is there to tell us, hey, this isn't actually what you want to do. This isn't actually where you want to go. Let's pause. Let's take a step back. I'm really, really I tell entrepreneurs all the time, let's just take a step back.
Ellen 00:21:16 You know, we're so head down, blinders on, grind, build this company, do this thing. And taking a step back and saying, wait a second, what do I really want in life? What do I really want in business? And I might just doing this because I feel like this is what I'm supposed to do. You know, we chased success in entrepreneur world. I'm. I'm building my keynote. My, my new keynote is built around how can we be successful and happy in entrepreneurship because there's so many entrepreneurs who say, you know what, I don't believe I can have both. So I'm going to sacrifice happiness for success. And I hope that success brings me happiness, because that's what I the choice that I've made. And time and time after again, you know, Steve Jobs, there's all these quotes of these really successful people saying, hey, I built a really successful business, but I, I wasn't happy along the journey. And so part of my passion and what I want is for entrepreneurs and for people of any stage and, you know, any, any person really, to not just be successful, to do both, to be successful and find happiness along the way.
Brenda 00:22:13 That's right. Oh my gosh. So you reminded me when you were talking about this, that you and I met through the speaking program with Patrick Combs and Samantha Skelly and the thing that made me reach out and say, Ellen, please come on. The podcast was when you were talking about this intersection of happiness and success. Can you share a little bit about the the data that you discovered about? I mean, you you dove into it a little bit just now, but the things I it blew my mind. And also at the same time I was like, oh yeah, that tracks.
Ellen 00:22:47 Yeah. I mean the, the stats are crazy. Here. Let me see if I can, give you some. So you know, the stats on happiness and entrepreneurship. I have so many quotes from all these famous entrepreneurs. You know, Sara Blakely, for example, Spanx founder says even after Spanx became $1 billion business, I felt unfulfilled. The success was great, but it didn't bring me the happiness I thought it would.
Ellen 00:23:12 I had to find balance and purpose in other areas of my life. And I think that that, I mean, there's so many of these. But 27% of entrepreneurs suffer from anxiety, 12% have substance abuse problems, and and 72%. This blew my mind. 72% of successful entrepreneurs suffer from mental health problems, and I think it's the 72%. Yeah.
Brenda 00:23:35 Oh my gosh.
Ellen 00:23:36 Yeah. And I would say the entrepreneurs that I've met, yeah, there's this sense of I have to be successful and I will sacrifice everything at the altar of success. Don't take that away from me. And I think a lot of what I'm learning is be successful, be all out in your business, go after your dreams. But also make sure that you have a life outside of your business. Make sure you have friends outside of your business. Make sure you have hobbies. Make sure you play. I had a mentor. He's an investment banker and I was telling him all the things that I was doing and he was like, wow, Ellen, this is incredible.
Ellen 00:24:10 You built this beautiful path and road, you know, roadmap for your professional life. But what about your personal have you done the same thing in your personal life? And I find entrepreneurs so often don't. So it's like we put all of our time and energy into planning how we're going to be successful in business. Let's put maybe not as much, but let's at least put some energy and effort into how do we build a successful, beautiful life apart from our business so that the two work together? They're not against each other? Does that make sense? Like, oh my gosh.
Brenda 00:24:42 I mean so much sense. Yeah. So I work with empathic entrepreneurs, people with deep empathy and deep compassion. And one of the things that happens for so many empathic entrepreneurs is they start to get their personal needs filled through their business, their need for purpose, their need for connection, their need for love. And when that happens, it creates really messy lines in between what's professional, what's personal, and those messy lines can create some kinks in the energy and also revenue.
Brenda 00:25:14 Because if you're mixing those, those things and you're getting your needs filled through your business, most often, in my experience, it's a child part that is the need that we're that we're filling. And then we have this whole other set of problems. When your eight year old is making the decisions for your company.
00:25:33 Yeah. Yeah.
Ellen 00:25:34 No. Absolutely. Yeah. And I would say even 2 or 3 relationships, you know, entrepreneurs often have a high rate of divorce because they spend all their time and energy in their business and their partner a lot of times, rightly so. We'll say, hey, what about me? You made a commitment to me too. So what does that look like? How can we build a beautiful relationship, whether it's marriage or kids or all those things like those things are, if not more important than your business. So are we putting the time and the energy? You know, entrepreneurs have a hard time putting their phone away, putting their email away, putting their laptop in a way and saying, no, this is important, and I want to be present and I want to show up not just for my business, but for the people in my, my life, because that is so important to build a beautiful life.
Brenda 00:26:15 That's right. So are there 2 or 3 things that you find entrepreneurs consistently can shift so that they can put the focus on their personal life in addition to their business.
Ellen 00:26:27 Yeah, I, I love this concept of entrepreneurs will do anything it takes to win. And they apply that to their business. And I would love entrepreneurs to do whatever it takes to win and their personal life too. Like it was really interesting. my mentor was telling me he's like, you know what? Have you applied that same mindset to your hobbies? Like, what would change if you apply that mindset to do whatever it takes to make sure that you have a hobby? And I'm like, oh, I would buy a guitar tomorrow and I would sign up for lessons because that's what we do as entrepreneurs. We find coaches, we buy the things that we need, and we do it and we put it in our schedule. So it's like, what if we took the same? I'm not asking entrepreneurs to change. What I'm asking them to do is shift their perspective.
Ellen 00:27:10 Take those same things that make you an amazing entrepreneur and and look at your life and make it like that. So, you know, do the same thing in your personal life that you're doing in your business, which is you're doing whatever it takes to win. You have a vision. The best entrepreneurs have a vision and they build a team. So having that same concept of having a vision, building a team, doing whatever it takes, take that, apply it to your personal life. And then in the business, you know, we want to lead with our unique ability in our personal life. Let's let's enjoy the unique ability of other people. Let's bring out the unique gifts, gifts of the people around us. So it's like to me, it's I'm not trying to change who you are. What I'm trying to do is just open your mind and your perspective to there can be more than what it is right now. It can be better and beautiful in your personal life in the same way that you're you're approaching this entrepreneur journey.
00:27:59 I.
Brenda 00:27:59 Love that. So one of the things that I hear people say is I don't know how to make friends, I'm an adult, I live in this city and X, Y, Z and blah blah blah. What is something that you would invite an entrepreneur to do in order to start to create and cultivate some of these relationships?
Ellen 00:28:17 Yeah. I think, you have to pause to create real connection. Building friendships is about building genuine connection, and the only way that you can build genuine connection is you have to get outside of yourself. You have to stop with the internal, you know, what am I getting? You know, I think entrepreneurs, they think, is this productive? What am I getting out of this? What's my ROI on this? Right.
00:28:40 That's right. Yeah.
00:28:41 Great. And so they.
Ellen 00:28:42 Go into these things and they're like, all right, I need a I need a friend. I need to build a crew. Because if I, this crew is going to support me and we're going to support each other and we're going to get a better ROI by having a crew around you.
Ellen 00:28:51 And it's like, no, that's not how friendship works. How friendship works is I see you, I know you, I care about you. And in order to see someone, you have to stop looking at yourself. You have to you have to be present. You have to listen. You have to care. And that that knowing part is paying attention and remembering and caring about this person across from you. And it's so interesting because, you know, people think of genuine connection only in personal. And I have found it as completely changed my entrepreneur journey.
Brenda 00:29:20 I was going to ask that because it seems to me like the idea of seeing someone and knowing them and caring about them is also what would make you a really desirable business to work with.
Ellen 00:29:32 Oh my gosh, the amount of opportunities and adventures that I have been on by doing this in personal and business is like I was at Genius Network sitting around a bonfire. I'm talking to these two Israelis. I lived in Israel for a part of my 20s, and we're just talking, we're sharing, we're laughing, we're enjoying each other.
Ellen 00:29:52 And they look at me and they go, it was a couple, and they look at me and they go, hey, we're going to Maui in two months. Do you want to come and hang out with us? I'm like, absolutely, I do. So we spent eight days in Maui. We paddleboard with whales like one of the most incredible experiences of my life. And if you approach business and life as a transaction, you are going to miss out on the beauty of life. And I think approaching people and opportunities and all of this with I'm just I'm curious. I'm open. Like that whole concept of being curious. I'm I love people, I'm curious about people. I want to know about more of them. I want to see them. I want to know them. I want to love them. And a in approaching the world that way is so different than what most people do. And and to me, it's the only way that you're going to build genuine connection. And so even in like, actually Sam and I, that's how we became friends.
Ellen 00:30:38 We were at an event together. We sat down and we just were like, hey, what's going on with you? I want to know you like you're you seem amazing. And she is, of course. And we became like, amazing friends in two days. I'm going to her wedding in like two weeks because we just we didn't approach it as, this is a transaction. What can I get out of this relationship? What's my ROI on this relationship? No, it was I'm just I want to know you. I'm curious about you. And I want to build a genuine connection that's more important to me than the transaction that we could have between each other.
Brenda 00:31:08 I love that that's where my values lie to in valuing relationships and people Over any other transaction. And one of the things that a lot of empaths fear. Is that if they prioritize the relationship, that they will create an imbalance. And so a lot of the people that I work with are scared of disappearing and having their needs come last because they have typically come last.
Brenda 00:31:37 and so if you're working with a business owner who deeply wants and values relationship and they fear disappearing inside the relationship, maybe to the point that they can't work their own business or to the point that they're giving away things for free, what would you say to that person?
Ellen 00:31:57 read Adam Grant givers. he's got this amazing book givers and takers read that book because he basically talks about there's two types of givers. There's doormats and they're strategic givers. and doormats are on the bottom and strategic givers are on the top, so the way it goes is strategic givers, matchers, takers, and, you know, basically people that just give without discernment. Honestly, at the end of the day, it's really about discernment. empaths and people that are able to go to the deep places, they're able to hold a lot of space. And I would say they hold space better than almost anyone in the world. And because they can hold so much space, people give them so much because they're able to hold that. And I think what I've learned in my life, I definitely would consider myself one of those.
Ellen 00:32:43 And I think what I've learned in my life is this discernment on how much can how much of my space can this person hold, and I get to make the choice whether I hold it for this person or not?
Brenda 00:32:55 That's right.
Ellen 00:32:56 Right. And so I think you don't have to hold all everyone's space and you can make the decision, this is a person I want to hold space for, and this is a person that I don't want to hold space for. And you can do it with kindness and graciousness. And you know, what level are we going to be at? Because that's the level that this person is at, and I'm going to meet them where they're at. I'm not always going to be level ten no matter where the other person is, because honestly, imbalance is not a good thing in relationships. And so sometimes it's I'm going to meet this person at the level that they're at so that we're not out of an imbalance. And then we build along the way. The problem, I think, with empaths and all these things is we know how to go deep really fast.
Ellen 00:33:34 That's one of the best lessons I've learned from my friend Audrey, was that the steps are beautiful. And going to level ten. You know, I the best analogy I can think of is swimming the idea of being in the ocean. There's people that you want to play on the beach with. There's people that you want to snorkel with, and then there are people that you scuba dive with. But if you have never met this person before and you dive to the depths of the ocean and you have to buddy breathe for each other, right? You see what I'm saying? It's too far, it's too fast, it's too quick, and it's actually beautiful to learn how to swim with someone, to learn how to snorkel with someone, and then to say, hey, I think we could scuba together. Let's figure out how we do this together. And then realizing too, that, hey, don't spend all your time scuba diving like you should have friends at every single level. You should be playing on the beach with people, you should be surfing with people.
Ellen 00:34:22 And then there's only a select few you should be scuba diving with, and being really discerning about who those people are. And it's because you know them, you see them and you've you've built a relationship where that can be sustainable, that you can build on that. So to me, it's just because you can go there. It doesn't mean that you should.
00:34:39 Oh, I love.
Brenda 00:34:40 That, I love that. So I'll link that book in the show notes, the Givers and Takers. I think that's really important. And you know, when you're thinking about I love the analogy of the beach, the swimming around, you know, floating in the water, splashing and then scuba diving. I love that analogy. And when you're talking about holding space, do you want to hold space for this person? One of the things that's really made a difference for me personally is the sense of I've got me. And if I sense that you've got you, then I know that there's safety there. And so we can kind of experiment with how far into the water do we want to go? But if I know that I've got me and I don't feel that you have you, then I know that I'm going to probably stay on the beach.
Ellen 00:35:27 And that's a choice that you get to make, right?
00:35:29 Yeah. Yeah, yeah.
Brenda 00:35:30 And so I love that analogy that I think that's so beautiful. Yeah.
00:35:34 Absolutely.
Brenda 00:35:34 So in your journey, how have you been able to create a rich personal life and a successful business? How have you managed your time? How do you orient it? How do you articulate it? Are there conversations that you need to have and how does that how does that work for you?
Ellen 00:35:56 Yeah. One thing I've done, which I highly recommend, is I color coordinate my calendar and I have self-care time. I have personal development time, client time, and friend time. And I just look at my calendar. Where am I spending my time? Am I overloaded on work? And it's all work, and I haven't spent any time with the people that I love, my family and my friends, all those things. And so I really, I think being proactive about it and also understanding where am I spending my time and energy.
Ellen 00:36:22 I love doing calendar audits, like where am I spending my time in my energy?
00:36:25 Me too.
Ellen 00:36:26 And how much do I have, you know, for new opportunities. And so I think I think, you know, I know being self-aware, I think is really important. So I know what I need, which is I need athletic things to do, activities. I'm I love to hike and to be in nature and to all those things. I need time with my my people. Like I need my genuine connection time. And so I just make sure when I'm looking I'm like, where am I overweighted and where do I need more of like, oh wow, I've the last month I've traveled and done all work. It's time for some vacations. It's time for some genuine connection. It's time for, you know, athletic activity. So really built. And when I talk about I'm a planner, I'm a certified financial planner. So to me it's like, where is my life plan? Where am I spending my time? What do I need more of? What do I need less of that sort of thing.
Ellen 00:37:10 So I think doing audits. I love Dan Martel's book. I think it's called, Take Buyback. Your time is a great book. Nick Peterson's book bumpers is absolutely fantastic. So I'm a big reader, if you can't tell, I love books. but it's really about, you know, I love this quote. I wanted to read it for your audience, but success is getting what you want. Happiness is knowing what that is.
00:37:36 Yeah. Oh that's that's so good. Right.
Ellen 00:37:39 And so I think you know being just having time for reflection, taking time out of your busy life and saying what am I doing with my life? Where am I spending my time? What do I love? What do I hate, what do I need to get, you know, what do I need to cut out and what do I need to add? And just taking the time. I know I've said that like a million times, but so often it's just we don't pause. We don't reflect. We don't ask ourselves what's going on.
Ellen 00:38:00 You know, if I'm feeling frazzled, if I'm feeling overwhelmed, I've I've really burned out. How can I step back and change something in my life? Because those, you know, those are the signals that we all ignore. But, you know, I got Hashimoto's because I ignore the signal, so please don't do that. And now I'm so hyper aware of, like, how do I feel? What can I change? What do I need? You know, what? What priorities do I need to change in order to live this beautiful life?
Brenda 00:38:25 I love that I also teach and live by the color coded calendar. I find it was a it's a game changer. It's really easy to justify overworking if you don't have the color code. And the first time I did it, I was shocked at how much I was working. I, I was telling myself I had balance, but balance was not even kind of in the picture until I started color coding. So I love that you mentioned that.
Brenda 00:38:51 And I'll link Nick Peterson's book in the show notes as well. Oh my gosh, so good. So how can people work with you and where can they find you?
00:38:59 Well,
Ellen 00:39:00 You know what? I'm just going to put my email out here. Why not? Elena. Build Proofs Elle.com. You can check out our website build profile.com and then always follow me on Instagram Ellen Long style. My friend actually came up with that. She's like, your life is just it's a whole style. Like it's Ellen Long style. Do you do you do. So they want to follow me on Instagram, hit me up. You know, they can always DM me. I'm happy to help. I love helping people figure out, you know, how do I align my business, my professional life, my, you know, personal life? And how can I architect it in a way that I just love? I wake up every day and I love my life. That's that's really my goal for people. So I really encourage you to build something that you can look back on and say, you know, I built a beautiful life and I loved it.
00:39:44 that's so.
Brenda 00:39:44 Good. It's so good. And it comes back to where we started, which is the road less traveled. So, so many times. You know, we think about we have to do things a particular way in a particular formula in a particular order. And maybe that's not true.
00:39:59 Maybe that's not true.
Ellen 00:40:01 Maybe you can do it. Do whatever you know. Maybe you can build your own thing. Be the creator and architect of your own life.
00:40:08 We all.
Brenda 00:40:09 Have that. We all have that potential if we decide to claim it. Amen. Ellen, thank you so much for being a guest. I have loved this conversation. Is there anything else you want to say to the audience before we close?
Ellen 00:40:22 I would say instead of building a vision board, which I love, a vision board, nothing. Not knocking a vision board, but instead of building a vision board, I would really encourage people to build a life plan. it's so much deeper than a vision board, and it's easy to accept the blueprint of life.
Ellen 00:40:40 And a lot of people's vision board looks exactly the same. A nicer car, a nicer house, more vacations, a better business. And yes, all those things are wonderful to chase after, if that's really what you want. If that's really what makes you happy. I encourage people to go deeper than that. So really, at the end of the day, I just encourage your audience to go deeper than a vision board. To really ask yourself why? Why do I want a bigger house? What is it about that that is going to make my life more beautiful? And is that really the most important thing to me? And really prioritizing, prioritizing the things that are really important to you, not the standard blueprint of what a vision board successful life looks like?
Brenda 00:41:19 I love that with every fiber of my being. So I just lost my dad in August, and one of the things that he just kept saying was, I lived such a good life and I have no regrets. And I thought to myself, what a powerful statement to be able to say.
Brenda 00:41:36 I lived a good life and I have no regrets. And then I met somebody else. A friend of mine introduced me to her grandfather, who is just a little bit older than my dad. After my dad had passed and he was saying the same thing. I lived such a good life, and so may we all just live a good life that we feel proud of without regrets.
00:41:56 Awesome.
Brenda 00:41:56 Thank you Ellen.
00:41:57 Thanks so much for having me.
